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Aarkayne
PostPosted: Sun Feb 02, 2003 8:47 pm 
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Clearly the author has ventured into unknown waters and desperately misquotes figures etc., yet it is an interesting thought that perhaps it is high time the powers that be and the policy makers realise that just as s/w was a boom industry throughout the nineties, entertainment can become one of the major exports out of India. The infrastructure exists and a testing ground as well in terms of the widely diverse audience base....so will someone at a management institute in India offer a program in entertainment/media management and actually start producing trained people willing to run the industry?

Read on in any case -

http://www.rediff.com/movies/2003/jan/30bolly.htm


http://www.rediff.com/movies/2003/jan/30bolly.htm
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Kishi6406
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 03, 2003 11:56 pm 
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We can't go international, not with the state of the industry: films are flopping, and there are too many Hollywood rip-offs. If we go international, they'll make fun of us even more, and see how horribly we remade their films. Plus, why would they want to see an Indianised version of the film they've seen 10 times?

I love Hindi films, we just need a big change in order to make this big step.
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DragunR2
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 04, 2003 12:40 am 
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Certain films might be released internationally, like Lagaan. Or maybe some Indian co-productions with the US or UK could be made. But India hopefully wouldn't be trying to send the mainstream crap overseas. Only select films with possible arthouse and/or mainstream appeal overseas should be the object of international marketing. But if the filmmakers consciously tailor their films for everyone, the films will be poor.
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Aryan
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 04, 2003 11:57 am 
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I think we can go global, in another way - not like Hollywood, but rather like the French, Italian or even Chinese and Japanese industries. This means only the best of our movies should be exported - not your regular made-for-rickshawalas fare.
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Babelover
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 05, 2003 3:44 am 
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What do u mean can bollywood go global? Isnt it already global.
Bollywood movies are watched in asia, middle east (with arabic/hebrew subs), america and europe (with english subs) even africa. How much more global must it go?
Bollywood movies are available in all the continents mentioned above.
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DragunR2
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 05, 2003 4:45 am 
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Babelover wrote:
What do u mean can bollywood go global? Isnt it already global.
Bollywood movies are watched in asia, middle east (with arabic/hebrew subs), america and europe (with english subs) even africa. How much more global must it go?
Bollywood movies are available in all the continents mentioned above.

Global in this sense is that Indian films will be shown more often than today in arthouse theaters, some mainstream theaters, and other venues where it isn't primarily Indians watching. Just like French and Italian films are frequently imported into America. Non-Asians are becoming increasingly aware of Bollywood, though I suspect it is at first because of the kitsch factor. Hopefully they can move beyond the typical song-and-dance routine and discover some of the well made films of the genre as well as more artistic films.
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mhafner
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 05, 2003 10:20 am 
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Aryan wrote:
I think we can go global, in another way - not like Hollywood, but rather like the French, Italian or even Chinese and Japanese industries. This means only the best of our movies should be exported - not your regular made-for-rickshawalas fare.

This is already the case. Indian art house films have been available for decades in Western cinemas. It's just that
- the audience is small
- the films are not really different from art house films
of other countries
- the films are not representative of what Indians mostly
watch, it's not Bollywood.

Bollywood should go global with genuine Bollywood productions but on a high quality level (e.g. Lagaan, Dil
Chahta Hai, Company).
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DragunR2
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 05, 2003 5:59 pm 
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mhafner wrote:
This is already the case. Indian art house films have been available for decades in Western cinemas. It's just that
- the audience is small
- the films are not really different from art house films
of other countries
- the films are not representative of what Indians mostly
watch, it's not Bollywood.

Bollywood should go global with genuine Bollywood productions but on a high quality level (e.g. Lagaan, Dil
Chahta Hai, Company).

The occasional Indian arthouse films have made their way to the US, but not in nearly the numbers of European or Asian films. Perhaps fewer of these films are not being made? Or is it that the powers that be in India would rather support a film like Devdas because it was a it? I read an essay by Richard Schickel in which he laments the decline of arthouse theaters in the US. He mentions that in previous decades in New York, one could see many different foreign films.

I don't know about DCH, but Company and Satya were two good movies that should have been marketed to non-Indian audiences somewhat. Those were really interesting films, and even though gangster films like the ones Scorsese has made have been around for years in the West, Asian gangster films have a cult following. So why not those films?
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Babelover
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 05, 2003 10:51 pm 
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Bollywood movies arent going to appeal to western audiences, since they are just rip off of films they have already seen. They will just laugh and curse at the movie.
Therefore bollywood cant go global. Hong Kong movies didnt go global, they make some of the best original films, but still they dont appeal to majority of western audiences only some.
Only big movies like crouching tiger hidden dragon which was very popular globally.
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DragunR2
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2003 12:00 am 
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Babelover wrote:
Bollywood movies arent going to appeal to western audiences, since they are just rip off of films they have already seen. They will just laugh and curse at the movie.
Therefore bollywood cant go global. Hong Kong movies didnt go global, they make some of the best original films, but still they dont appeal to majority of western audiences only some.
Only big movies like crouching tiger hidden dragon which was very popular globally.

Well, nobody is proposing to market any of Mahesh Bhatt's films to Western audiences. There must be some good independent films that will appeal to Westerners, or barring that, a big budget film like Lagaan with wide appeal.
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Mr_Khiladi
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2003 12:05 am 
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Look guys, Bollywood films will NEVER be accepted by the rest of the world, until they start making more decent films. The vast majority are crap, only a few are good (e.g Lagaan). Bollywood makes too many mistakes with it's films, for example Asoka was ALMOST a good film, but it was ruined by those 'little things' which all contribute to making it look silly (which is the reason it wasn't taken seriously) - there was no need for Johnny lever's character and the soldiers and Danny's character was a joke! Also, taking a line from Crocodile Dundee won't impress the critics.

It's not that they were never appreciated (the Raj Kapoor directed films were appreciated in Russia). The thing is his films wern't too silly and offered social commentary as well as great acting and were quite challenging for their time. I think Mera Naam Joker was the first bollywood film the show an inter-racial kiss.

More REAL cinema like Monsoon Wedding will be appreciated and MW even won the Golden lion award at the venice film festival, which is an accievement in itself. Films like The Warrior, Salaam Bombay and The Terrorist are critically acclaimed, and have been taken seriously. The thing is India doesn't produce many of these films and these are not bollywood films but are referred to as 'contemporary'.

Plus we have the 'filmi fundas' lot who have tried their new approach but their films are also pretentious (e.g.snip), boring and are more interested in showing an India they want the rest of the world to believe than how it really is. Alot of people know this and that is another reason they are not taken seriously, however credit is given where credit is due and they are given some recognition for 'breaking the mold'.

Bollywood, is different...it is pretentious and ficticious and made only 'for the masses' who don't care for films with critical acclaim. And only want to see films which will help them forget their days worries and relax. To enjoy a fantasy like they wish they had, that's there whole purpose and that's the reason they are so successful in India and other 'likeminded' contries.
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Aryan
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2003 2:58 pm 
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Babelover, Hong Kong makes the best original stuff? You've got to be kidding. They don't make anything besides Kung Fu crap. Just a trivia, Hong Kong has NEVER had a film nominated for the Oscars. India has got 3. Two of which were out and out Bollywood films. Also, please note that Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon is not a Hong Kong film. Ang Lee is Taiwanese. Bollywood isn't that bad. Ignore the crap - just take the good stuff.
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darius25
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2003 3:52 pm 
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Aryan, if HK only makes kung-fu crap, could you please provide the reasoning behind some of these films:

The Killer
Hard Boiled
A Better Tomorrow
Bullet in the Head
City on Fire
Needing You
Just One Look
In the Mood for Love
Chungking Express
God of Gamblers
A Moment of Romance
La Brassiere
Infernal Affairs

I could go on....
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DragunR2
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2003 5:35 pm 
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Mr. Khiladi, you may have a point. Bollywood is almost overwhemingly dominated by "mass entertainers." Hollywood produces a lot of this crap too (just look at the films out currently), but at the end of the year, the major studios release many critically acclaimed films. This doesn't count the number of quality independently produced films also released. We just do not see much of this from the major Hindi producers. Deviation from the norm is usually from independent producers rather. The problem is, when non-Indians talk of Indian cinema, they are almost exclusively referring to mainstream Hindi cinema, when there are good films in other languages being released. But there have to be a handful of films that would appeal to an international group of film buffs. Films that were mainstream hits in their native countries like Amelie and Spirited Away were released to much acclaim in the US. I know nothing about the current state of the film industries of France and Japan, so for all I know those could be their only good films. But can you imagine a film that was a huge hit in India being of such high quality that it could be shown in the West?
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Mr_Khiladi
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 06, 2003 9:48 pm 
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DragunR2 wrote:
But can you imagine a film that was a huge hit in India being of such high quality that it could be shown in the West?

Well I think the scope will have to be limited. For example Lagaan was set during British rule and was about Cricket...something that could easily 'crossover' with the Brits, but won't do much for Americans as Cricket isn't there game. Lagaan was a big hit and I believe would have been much bigger if it was promoted right. In the UK it was shown during daytime in the weekend to pull in a larger audience than shown when they ususally show bollywood films (after 1am in the early hrs of Monday). If you go on the movie message boards on the net and even the reviews on amazon.com, you'll see that quite a few 'westeners' saw and liked Lagaan & Monsoon Wedding. Although Devdas did well to get nominated, people can see it's nothing but pure gloss, big budget, beatiful costumes, set design, etc with not much to say. It's eye-candy...it's noticed because it looks exotic, and beautiful and there was some good acting in it. Whereas you have other lesser budget films made like The Terrorist which wouldn't have got the recognition is deserved if John Malkovich hadn't steped in and promoted it.

Another problem with the mainstrean 'bollywood' films is the humour isn't very funny any more, it's just silly. The things India laughs at, I think the rest of the world would find either silly or unfunny, I myself as well as many people I know find most of the time, the humour just not funny enough. Now compare 'bollywood' humour (aka Johnny Lever, Govinda-type humour) with the humour from Monsoon Wedding, and you'll see that international audiences can identify with or 'feel' the humour in films like MW. I myself was at an open air screening of Monsoon Wedding at Regent Park UK, and the audience consisted of 50/50 Indians/Westeners and it went down well with everyone. Now imagine if it was a David Dhawan film being shown...most of the audience would walk away!
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