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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2005 6:27 pm 
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Many on zulm know what Super 35 process is. I have seen this discussed on zulm before, but never paid much attention to it.

Many of us are die hard advocates of OAR and many/ some, including myself, like to see DVDs with more picture on the top and bottom than a wide AR OAR film DVD gives.

I noticed this today on
http://sify.com/movies/bollywood/fullst ... wer~of~Two
"Shabd is the second Hindi film to be shot with a super 35 camera besides Musafir"
and found it interesting and doubtful when it mentioned of a forthcoming film to be only the second Hindi Super35 film, Musafir being the first one.


Search brought out this interesting info on Super 35 process:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/gu ... 84-3164032

SUPER 35

Super35 is a cinematographic process that was first used in the mid 1980s. The Wolfgang Petersen sci-fi flick 'Enemy Mine' is the first movie I can find that used this process. It's a little bit complicated, so here goes.

The Super35 process is an alternative to the Panavision process. It allows filmmakers a wide, panoramic theatrical image (2.35:1 aspect ratio) but without the massive cropping inherent in Full-Screen versions of scope movies. One director, for example, who uses this process pretty much exclusively is James Cameron. Cameron's films 'The Abyss (Special Edition)', 'Terminator 2 - Judgment Day (The Ultimate Edition DVD)', 'True Lies' and 'Titanic' are all filmed in the Super35 process. It has a few advantages over anamorphic processes, for example, anamorphic lenses frequently result in optical distortion which makes the use of computer graphics effects extraordinarily difficult. Because of this, films that feature CG effects, such as 'The Lord of the Rings - The Fellowship of the Ring (Widescreen Edition)', 'Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets (Widescreen Edition)', and 'The Matrix', often use the Super35 process.

Films that do not feature CG effects also sometimes use Super35 because it creates a greater depth of field than anamorphic. Also, anamorphic lenses are very expensive and result in heavier camera rigs. Super35 eliminates those problems as well.

Probably the biggest advantage is that filmmakers get a nice wide theatrical image, just like anamorphic Panavision, yet they don't have to worry about the serious cropping in pan and scan versions. Why is that, you may ask? Well, let's talk about that now.

HOW IT WORKS

Super35 uses a 35-millimeter film frame (aspect ratio 1.37:1). However, unlike a standard 35mm frame, the magnetic area usually reserved for the sound track is removed. The film uses a seperate digital soundtrack instead of the lower-quality optical soundtrack on the 35mm print. Removing the optical soundtrack results in a much wider negative (approx. 1.60:1). Therefore, Super35 films actually have a negative aspect ratio of 1.60:1 (approximately). From the 1.60:1 negative, they extract a 2.35:1 frame for theatrical exhibition. That means that not all of the picture information in the negative is seen in theaters. This is sort of similar to the soft-matting process. In theaters, you will see a wide 2.35:1 image. Are you with me so far?

Now then, when the film is to be released on DVD and VHS, the filmmakers will need to prepare Full-Screen versions. Some DVDs receive only widescreen releases, but the film will probably eventually be shown on television anyway, so a Full-Screen version will be needed. So the filmmakers go back to the original negative (1.60:1 aspect ratio) and extract a 1.33:1 image. This results in a little bit of cropping on the sides of the picture, however there will be a bit more information on the top and bottom than was seen at the theater. Sometimes, in a Full-Screen version of a Super35 film, you will see more picture only at the top of the screen than the theatrical version. Sometimes you will see more only at the bottom. Sometimes you will see more at the top and bottom. It all depends on how the 2.35:1 theatrical image was extracted.

This may result in a reaction of "Wow! I'm seeing more picture than was shown in theaters!", but really the theatrical image is what was intended to be seen. For Super35 films, 2.35:1 is still the original aspect ratio, because it is the aspect ratio that viewers were intended to see in the theater. Therefore, the widescreen version is still the preferred format. When shooting the film, the director has a TV monitor with a rectangular outline that represents the 2.35:1 image. This shows the director how he needs to frame his shots so that no essential information will be cut out of the frame. The shots are then composed for the 2.35:1 aspect ratio.

Hope that explained things clearly enough. Should you desire to know, there's an easy way to tell if a 2.35:1 film is anamorphic or Super35. Look in the background of a shot in the film. Look for light sources that are out of focus. If the out of focus lights appear in the shape of an oval, then the film is an anamorphic scope film. If the lights appear as regular circles, the film is Super35.

FILMS SHOT IN SUPER 35

In addition to all the ones listed above, there are many others films that use this process. For example: 'Top Gun', 'Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon', 'Gladiator', 'Black Hawk Down', 'Apollo 13', 'Ocean's Eleven (Widescreen Edition)', 'American Beauty', 'Fight Club (Single Disc Edition)', 'The Fast and the Furious', 'Seven (New Line Platinum Series)', 'The Usual Suspects (Special Edition)', 'Reservoir Dogs', 'Dogma', 'Legally Blonde', 'Lara Croft - Tomb Raider (Special Collector's Edition)', 'Training Day', and 'Panic Room (Superbit Collection)'.

------------------------------

This site lists lot other films that were shot on Super35 and hence will have a Fuller AR DVD available now or later.

Ali,
Do you recall our discussion on T-2 LD version being 4:3 that contained more picture at the top and bottom??


Last edited by rana on Sat Jan 28, 2006 9:11 am, edited 3 times in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2005 6:44 pm 
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I thought Kaante was also filmed on Super 35? In any case, Super 35 is nothing to be proud of!

James Cameron shoots all his 2.35:1 films using Super 35, but he closely supervises the 4:3 transfer so that they are framed as well as possible.

See this site for a basic rundown of the shooting formats, and a few caps from T2.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2005 4:17 am 
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Location: vancouver, canada
i remember on the finding nemo dvd the person on the dvd said that the fullscreen version on disk 2 does no have sides croped at all it has extra picture on top and bottom instead. is this also super35 or is it something else since they said they didnt crop anything


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2005 4:08 pm 
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CG films like Finding Nemo are different from live-action films. Pixar recomposes their widescreen films for the 4:3 versions, though I've read that some shots are merely cropped.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2005 4:17 pm 
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DragunR2 wrote:

See this site for a basic rundown of the shooting formats, and a few caps from T2.


I prefer T-2 shots with 4:3 framing as in most of the film 2.35:1 comes up with heads chopped off a bit and in 4:3 heads are intact and only a slight pirtion has been cut off from sides. Even this cropping, from the sides, could be avoided if they framed the whole pic in anamorphic 1.6:1 or 1.78:1.
I must admit one thing though. Agreed that director's intended AR was 2.35:1 and in 4:3 shots you do see/ notice mike booms and other artifacts in some scenes. Other than that, I prefer the fuller picture where heads are not chopped off.

http://sify.com/movies/bollywood/fullst ... wer~of~Two
site does mention lots of films that were shot on super35 and hence should be available with fuller AR for those who want a fuller picture and don't want to see compromised/ "heads cut off" picture, whether director intended it or not.


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PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2005 7:03 pm 
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Cropping much of the forehead and hair in closeups is an aesthetic decision done to draw more attention to the eyes.

Some American 2.35:1 films have been opened up to about 1.78:1 on DVD. The Recruit, which was shot on Super 35, is one, and so is the HD-shot Once Upon a Time in Mexico.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2005 7:39 am 
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http://idlebrain.com/news/2000march20/news266.html

Super35 for NTR's Ashok

NTR's Ashok is currently being shot with the latest trendy camera Super 35mm. The producer has spent around 25 lakhs to buy accessories of Super 35mm from Germany. A street set worth 60 lakhs is being constructed for this film in Hyderabad. The interval episode of this film is currently being shot in Vikarabad with 100's of fighters and junior artists by Stun Siva. Costumes for this film were purchased in countries like Germany, Singapore and Hong Kong. Sameera Reddy plays the female lead. Surender Reddy (Athanokkade fame) directs this film. Valluripally Ramesh produces Ashok on Maharshi Cinema banner. This film would be released either in the last week of Match or first week of April 2006.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2005 7:35 pm 
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http://www.cinesouth.com/masala/hotnews ... 05-4.shtml

Kamalahasan's high tech film
- 02.12.2005

Any new technical advancement in film making that enters Hollywood one year will get to Kollywood the next year - thanks to Kamalahasan! Everybody enjoyed Goutham's high-tech screenplay in 'Kaaka Kaaka.' If these two get together?

After the America stint, Kamal-Goutham unit has returned to Chennai. They have brought with them, 'Super 35mm' technology. This is supposed to be much superior to cinemascope in sharpness and quality. Used in multimillion dollar blockbusters in Hollywood, this technology will be used in 'Vettaiyaadu Vilayaadu' for the first time in a Tamil (India?) film.

The scenes featuring Kamal and Jyotika, Hollywood actor Anderson, new villains Salim and Balaji, will all be seen by viewers on this new technology. The film promises many more surprises on that line.

A real feast awaits the viewers!


Super35 is better than 'scope shooting? Puh-leez :roll: :roll: :roll:


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2005 2:30 pm 
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Super 35 is not superior to Panavision concerning image quality. it uses less negative and is grainier/fuzzyer for wide screen presentations.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2005 6:19 pm 
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mhafner wrote:
Super 35 is not superior to Panavision concerning image quality. it uses less negative and is grainier/fuzzyer for wide screen presentations.


I agree, I loved the look of Technavisio, shot both films Asambhav, and PIAM.

Some how I never got same feeling for Lakshya, due to possible use of some filters etc? :?: :idea:


Last edited by Zoran009 on Fri Jan 20, 2006 2:26 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 03, 2005 6:48 pm 
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mhafner wrote:
Super 35 is not superior to Panavision concerning image quality. it uses less negative and is grainier/fuzzyer for wide screen presentations.


If it is Indian labs doing the anamorphic extractions, I can only imagine how grainy they will look. Does doing a DI between the Super 35 and the anamorphic prints help reduce grain?


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 07, 2005 11:18 am 
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DragunR2 wrote:
mhafner wrote:
Super 35 is not superior to Panavision concerning image quality. it uses less negative and is grainier/fuzzyer for wide screen presentations.


If it is Indian labs doing the anamorphic extractions, I can only imagine how grainy they will look. Does doing a DI between the Super 35 and the anamorphic prints help reduce grain?


yes.

#Some how I never got same feeling for Lakshya, due to possible use of some filters etc?

Due to a not so great digital intermediate at 2K. Prints direct from the negative would have looked quite some better.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 21, 2005 11:03 pm 
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http://www.indiaglitz.com/channels/telu ... 19142.html

A novel try
IndiaGlitz [Monday, December 19, 2005]


Any film that tries to experiment deserves our backing.

The Lagadapati Sridhar produced Style is indeed trying out something new. The film has been shot on a Super 35 camera.

This is something done for the first time here.

The film, directed by Lawrence Raghavender, meanwhile, has completed shooting.

The audio release is slated for this month. It stars Lawrence, Prabhudeva, Raja, Charmi and Kamalinee Mukherjee.

This musical has music by Mani Sharma while Kabir Lal has handled the camera.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 23, 2005 7:57 pm 
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Super 35 is becoming a trend in the South, it seems. And the news websites are spreading the misinformation that it is better than anamorphic shooting :(

http://www.behindwoods.com/features/New ... anush.html

Super 35 for Puduppettai
December 23, 2005


Selvaraghavan is slogging hard to complete Puduppettai on which hangs the fate of his younger brother, Dhanush. Selva has the good policy of working with same team as that of his previous films. This ensures consistency. Accordingly, cinematographer Arvind Krishna and the director are on the same wavelength.

They have shot Puduppettai on Super 35 camera. This advanced technology will give better projection in cinemascope format. Puduppettai is the first south Indian film to be canned with this camera. Arvind Krishna was the villain who shot Kamal in the climax in Kurudhippunal.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 12:37 pm 
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Zinda is shot in Super 16mm to allow access for more wide angle lenses, in this case 5.6mm lenses, for extreme shots in the cell. I saw the film in cinema and I thought it looked atrocious but than the visuals suited the film.

Musafir looked great in cinemas but also because the Colour grading was top notch. The grain was not apparent. Super 35 again allowed the filmmakers access to more wide angle lenses for 'cool' shots. Although films like Tum Bin, Aapko Pehle Bhi Kahin Dekha Hai & Dus by Anubhav Sinha are shot using Panavision Cameras. They look great but I'm not too sure if they were shot in Panavision Super 35.

Mission Kashmir is another film that never fails to amaze me. Many films boasts about sync sound and colour grading but this film did all that before 6 years ago. I know that the film is shot using Panavision Cameras in some parts (the last show down scene with HR and SD)

All this films shot using Panavision Cameras have flawless visuals and unlike films shot in the classic anamorphic cinemascope lenses which suffer from having the sides squeezed because of the anamorphic lens.


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